Rules to Play By Settling Disputes

By Golf Channel DigitalOctober 18, 2007, 4:00 pm
Editor's note: Each week, Ray Herzog, a rules expert from the San Diego Golf Academy in Orlando, Fla., will be answering reader-submitted questions involving the Rules of Golf. Look for Ray's Q&A every Thursday on GOLFCHANNEL.com.
 
My partner's 2nd shot ended up to the left of the green. He hit his 3rd shot, which ended up logded 30 feet high in the dead fronds of a palm tree. We waited about 30 seconds - it didn't come down. He took a drop about 10 feet back from the tree, giving him a nice angle to the front of the green. While addressing his new ball, the original ball fell from the tree, landing near the trunk.
 
I argued that the penalty stroke and newly dropped ball should be played, because he addressed his dropped ball. I felt that he should be hitting 5 with the tree still in front of him. He argued that he never declared his ball lost, and can play the original as his 4th shot, because addressing the ball is not the same as taking a stroke.
 
Who is right? He addressed the dropped ball, but didn't swing, before the original fell from the tree. Hitting 5 with the original around a tree vs. hitting 4 to punch out from underneath would have made a big difference in our game.
 
Thanks!
Kevin

 
Kevin,
 
You have got an awful lot going on: a lost ball, dropping in the wrong place, and playing a wrong ball. If you allowed your buddy to play from underneath the tree, you definitely got the short end of the stick.
 
When he hit his shot into the tree and could not see it, his ball was considered lost and he had five minutes to find or identify it. Since he did not wait and dropped another ball, his first ball was deemed lost. His dropped ball became the ball in play as soon as he dropped it. You do not have to address the ball or make a stroke at the ball for it to be the ball in play. When the original ball then fell out of the tree he was not allowed to play it because he had put another ball into play. The fact that he dropped in the wrong place is irrelevant right now. His only option for a lost ball is stroke and distance. He should have dropped his ball back to his previous spot to the left of the green, lying 4, hitting 5.
 
If he did not pick up the ball and re-drop it in the correct place he would receive additional penalty strokes. If he played his dropped ball from the wrong place, add two strokes for playing from the wrong place and let him putt it out. If he picked that one up and played his original ball from under the tree, he is now playing a wrong ball. That is a two-stroke penalty and he must correct the mistake before he tees off the next teeing ground. If he does not correct the mistake then it would be a disqualification penalty. Hopefully you did not have a big bet on you game; there is nothing we can do about it now.
-- Ray
 
Ray,
 
If you are in the middle of the fairway (which means the ball is in play) and your practice stroke accidentally hits the ball, what is the ruling? You did not intend to hit the ball so is it deemed a stroke regardless? If it is deemed a stroke, do you play it where it ended up? If it's not a stroke, I assume you put the ball back where it was.
 
Along those lines: If you accidentally hit a ball off the tee with your club, it is not deemed a stroke because the ball is not in play yet right?
 
Thanks,
Teri Chapple, Cottage Grove, MN

 
Teri,
 
This is an easy one. The answer to you question can be found in the very front of your rule book under the definition of stroke. For a player to make a stroke, there has to forward movement of a club with the intention of striking at and moving the ball. When you are taking a practice swing, there is no intent. So there was no stroke.
 
The proper thing to do is move the ball back to its original position with a one-stroke penalty for moving your ball in play. If you do not move the ball back and play it from its new position, you would receive a penalty for playing from a wrong place. The total penalty strokes for this error would be two strokes.
 
In your example on the tee box, your answer is correct but the ruling is not. When you moved the ball on the tee box, it is not a stroke because there was no intent to strike the ball. The good thing is that it is not a penalty because the ball was not in play yet.
-- Ray
 
Friday (at the Samsung), Paula Creamer's approach to the green ended up plugged in the rough near to a bunker. After consulting a rules official, she got to lift and drop her ball. Isn't this allowed only for a plugged lie in a 'closely mown area?'
 
Robert Morley, Niagara on the Lake, Ontario

 
Robert,
 
I did not witness the ruling but maybe I can shed some light on your question. In professional tournaments they normally play the embedded ball rule in closely mown areas. Closely mown areas would include walkways, fairways, and fringes. If a players ball is embedded in one of these areas they can lift, clean, and drop the ball as close to the pitch mark as possible.
 
In some of the tournaments we play in Florida, we will play embedded ball through the green. Basically, this would be everyone on the course except water hazards and bunkers. The reason we do this is because of the soft sandy soil and the constant threat of rain. We seem to get a lot of embedded golf balls in the rough just off the fairway. It is more fair to the player to let them take embedded ball relief.
 
As far as the ruling, maybe there was a local rule allowing embedded ball through the green, or she got relief from something else we could not see. I know that doesnt completely answer your question, but I thought I would give it a shot. I needed to see the ruling to give you a better answer.
-- Ray
 
Ray,
 
You answered a guy's question about clearing a water hazard on a par 3 in the last issue. My situation is different in that I am hitting to an island hole. The drive clears the water and lands on the island but bounces to a slope and rolls into the water on the side of the island. There is also a drop area. Where do I play the ball from? Where it crossed the hazard line on the island or from the drop area?
 
Thanks for your help.
Ray Ptak

 
Ray,
 
You have the three options I listed last week plus an additional option of using the ball drop. Your ball crossed the margin of the hazard next to the green. Since it was an island green, the three water hazard options dont really assist you in any way. You can play out of the water, go straight back with the flagstick (deeper into the water), or go back to the tee. Basically the penalty when you miss an island green is stroke and distance. That is why the course will provide a ball drop area. Whether you use the ball drop area is your call. They are just providing it as an additional option. I myself would recommend using the ball drop. I remember watching the first round of THE PLAYERS Championship this year when over 40 golf balls were hit into the water at the 17th hole on the first day of the tournament. I know those players were glad they had the option of a ball drop.
 
Thank you for your questions,
Ray Herzog
 
Email your Rules of Golf questions to Ray
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What's in the bag: CareerBuilder winner Rahm

By Golf Channel DigitalJanuary 22, 2018, 10:37 pm

Jon Rahm defeated Andrew Landry in a playoff to earn his second PGA Tour title at the CareerBuilder Challenge. Here's what's in his bag:

Driver: TaylorMade M4 (9.5 degrees), with Aldila Tour Green 75 TX shaft

Fairway wood: TaylorMade M3 (19 degrees), with Aldila Tour Green 75 TX shaft

Irons: TaylorMade P790 (3), P750 (4-PW), with Project X 6.5 shafts

Wedges: TaylorMade Milled Grind (52, 56 degrees), Milled Grind Hi-Toe (60 degrees), with Project X 6.5 shafts

Putter: TaylorMade Spider Tour Red

Ball: TaylorMade TP5x

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Strange irked by Rahm-Landry friendly playoff

By Jason CrookJanuary 22, 2018, 9:45 pm

Curtis Strange knows a thing or two about winning golf tournaments, and based on his reaction to the CareerBuilder Challenge playoff on Sunday, it’s safe to say he did things a little differently while picking up 17 PGA Tour victories in his Hall-of-Fame career.

While Jon Rahm and Andrew Landry were “battling” through four extra holes, Strange, 62, tweeted his issues with the duo’s constant chit-chat and friendly banter down the stretch at La Quinta Country Club, where Rahm eventually came out on top.

The two-time U.S. Open champ then engaged with some followers to explain his point a little more in depth.

So, yeah ... don't think he's changing his perspective on this topic anytime soon ever.

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Randall's Rant: The Euros won't just roll over

By Randall MellJanuary 22, 2018, 9:36 pm

The Ryder Cup may not be the King Kong of golf events yet, but you can hear the biennial international team event thumping its chest a full eight months out.

As anticipation for this year’s big events goes, there is more buzz about Europe’s bid to hold off a rejuvenated American effort in Paris in September than there is about the Masters coming up in April.

Thank Europe’s phenomenal success last weekend for that.

And Rory McIlroy’s impassioned remarks in Abu Dhabi.

And the provocative bulletin board material a certain Sports Illustrated writer provided the Europeans a couple months ago, with a stinging assault on the Euro chances that read like an obituary.

McIlroy was asked in a news conference before his 2018 debut last week what he was most excited about this year.

The Ryder Cup topped his list.

Though McIlroy will be trying to complete the career Grand Slam at Augusta National come April, he talked more about the Ryder Cup than he did any of the game’s major championships.

When asked a follow-up about the American team’s resurgence after a task-force overhaul and the injection of young, new star power, McIlroy nearly started breaking down the matchup. He talked about the young Americans and how good they are.

“Yeah, the Americans have been, obviously, very buoyant about their chances and whatever, but it’s never as easy as that. ... The Ryder Cup’s always close,” McIlroy said. “I think we’ll have a great team, and it definitely won’t be as easy as they think it’s going to be.”



McIlroy may have been talking about Alan Shipnuck’s bold prediction after the American Presidents Cup rout last fall.

Or similar assertions from TV analysts.

“The Ryder Cup is dead – you just don’t know it yet,” Shipnuck wrote. “One of the greatest events in sport is on the verge of irrelevancy. The young, talented, hungry golfers from the United States, benefitting from the cohesive leadership of the Task Force era, are going to roll to victory in 2018 in Paris.”

European Ryder Cup captain Thomas Bjorn won’t find words that will motivate the Euros more than that as he watches his prospective players jockey to make the team.

And, boy, did they jockey last weekend.

The Euros dominated across the planet, not that they did it with the Ryder Cup as some rallying cry, because they didn’t. But it was a heck of an encouraging start to the year for Bjorn to witness.

Spain’s Jon Rahm won the CareerBuilder Challenge on the PGA Tour, England’s Tommy Fleetwood started the week at Abu Dhabi paired with American and world No. 1 Dustin Johnson and won the European Tour event, and Spain’s Sergio Garcia won the Singapore Open in a rout on the Asian Tour.

And McIlroy looked close to being in midseason form, tying for third in his first start in three months.

Yes, it’s only January, and the Ryder Cup is still a long way off, with so much still to unfold, but you got an early sense from McIlroy how much defending European turf will mean to him and the Euros in Paris in September.

The Masters is great theater, the U.S. Open a rigorous test, The Open and the PGA Championship historically important, too, but the Ryder Cup touches a nerve none of those do.

The Ryder Cup stokes more fervor, provokes more passion and incites more vitriol than any other event in golf.

More bulletin board material, too.

Yeah, it’s a long way off, but you can already hear the Ryder Cup’s King Kong like footsteps in its distant approach. Watching how the American and European teams come together will be an ongoing drama through spring and summer.

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Quail Hollow officials promise players easier conditions

By Rex HoggardJanuary 22, 2018, 9:14 pm

Quail Hollow Club - a staple on the PGA Tour since 2003 - debuted as a longer, tougher version of itself at last year’s PGA Championship, receiving mixed reviews from players.

The course played to a lengthened 7,600 yards at last year’s PGA and a 73.46 stroke average, the toughest course in relation to par on Tour in 2017. As a result, it left some players less than excited to return to the Charlotte, N.C.-area layout later this spring for the Wells Fargo Championship.

It’s that lack of enthusiasm that led officials at Quail Hollow to send a video to players saying, essentially, that the course players have lauded for years will be back in May.

The video, which includes Quail Hollow president Johnny Harris and runs nearly five minutes, begins with an explanation of how the first hole, which played as a 524-yard par 4 at the PGA, will play much shorter at the Wells Fargo Championship.

“I had a number of my friends who were playing in the tournament tell me that tee was better suited as a lemonade stand,” Harris joked of the new tee box on the fourth hole. “I doubt we’ll ever see that tee used again in competition.”

Harris also explained that the greens, which became too fast for some, will be “softer” for this year’s Wells Fargo Championship.